in a few hours.

a changed man?

I heard he was asking for a stay of execution. I assuming it didn't work? I've read someof his stuff and it sounded like he changed but I dunno really on that one...

founder of the crips?

jesus, that's not very wholesome.

I'm not particularly in favor of the death penalty, but I think if you commit murder you have to take responsibility for your actions. Paying WHAT price is debatable.

It's like the problem I have with Christianity: be a fucker in life, then "repent" at the 11th hour, and enjoy paradise. EAT ME.

I agree with you totally and I didn't say he should be granted the stay of execution. But some of the shit he wrote, based on the very large mistakes he made, made sense. If only the rest of the gangstas could read they might see and read what he went through and realize that that lifestyle is like flushing your life down a big toilet. I guess the big toilet isn't all bad since most live in the sewer(ghetto) anyway...

fuck that guy...he killed 4 people

Die when you die, when you die, you're gonna die.

i love the death penalty. we need it in massachusetts.

the funny thing here is, we (meaning myself included) all write about and make heroes out of serial killers but some black gangster kills a few people and it's like the devil incarnate has been let loose. Regardless, whether you kill 1, 2, 3 or 4,000 people the death penalty should immediatly be imposed upon dna proof that the crimes were committed by the person being charged. Like I've said before, public executions need to come back so idiots can see just what happens to them when they do stupid shit like kill people.

AUTOPSY_666 said:

GG!

And I agree with Nate's last post.

KILL HIM!
I'm a strong supporter of the death penalty. The assholes outside the prison make me sick. Them faggo-leftist-ACLU types who's hearts bleed for the execution of murderers are the same assholes who lobby congress so that women have the 'choice' to abort any babies.

hungta‘bleed said:


Actually, last time I looked it was the faggot right wing retards like yourself who lobby for pro life. Us left wingers already have roe vs. wade to support us, we're just busy trying to keep the religious right like yourselves from taking that away from us.

By the way, they're fetuses, not babies.

That said, we've establishes a REFORM based prison system. The death penalty was for the unrepentant, unreformable folks who were seen as a continued threat to society. Expecting an execution for someone who makes some progress at reform is just as foolish as expecting a dismissal of all charges for that same person. Let him rot in jail for life, pay his debt, and continue writing his books.

We'll just assume that all those insults about bleeding hearts are your way of saying thank you for the 40 hour work week, vacation pay, free speech, and all the other things us pinkos are respobsible for or protect.

By the way, what example are we setting when we can set a standard of "eye for an eye" for the judicial system, yet make the same standard inaplicable towards the average private citizen?

You think you could make any headway, trying to explain to some poor uneducated gang banging thug that it's morally right and legally okay to murder murderers, but that such justice is equally as wrong for them to extract themselves? Most gang related murders are vigilante style acts of retaliation or vengence. The last thing we need to do is set the wrong example as a nation.

hungta‘bleed said:


I'm not sure why choice would be in quotes there....are you trying to be ironic, or referencing something? in the first case, explain the irony (it's not remotely clear)

second case, give me a works cited.

FAGGO-LEFTIST-ACLU TYPE said:


amen.

And don't forget the welfare system, wick, and other wonderful burdens the far left has placed on my weekly paycheck.

Hmmmm, seems both sides can be in the wrong, eh?

ArrowHead nli said:


"Hey, remember the other day when you were asking me aboutthe definition of irony?"

ArrowHead nli said:


every side and everything in between is bound to create a scenario that a large chunk of people will hate.

Focusing on one particular extreme just increases pool of people who are likely to get pissed.

Unfortunately, the system requires dissatisfaction to remain relevant. etc. etc. etc.

Exactly, that's my point brian. Taking examples of the far left or far right is always going to show extremes, both good and bad. That's why it's the left and right. Ideally, we all would like to live in the middle ground somewhere, but without BOTH extremes existing, we wouldn't benefit nearly as much from out current political system.

Anyone who claims one side is more "right" than the other is missing this point entirely.

didn't Texas recently have another executed prisoner proven to be innocent? I'm pretty sure...
I'm gonna go burn a flag now, just cuz i can.

Was he executed or what?...I could not find it on TV

I dunno bout you guys but I wanna fuck Nancy Grace wild.

Yeah he's gonna be executed, Jamie Foxx says theres gonna be riot too.

Riots are good for the economy.

Burn LA, burn!

i think the death penalty sucks mainly for the reason that i strongly believe that the state shouldnt be able to control life and death. which is the same reason i am pro-euthenasia and pro-choice. i am not overtly political or anything but its like...they can tell us we have to live when we dont want to and they can tell us when we are going to die? doesnt seem right to me.

in any event, this guy obviously did some terrible shit and ruined a bunch of peoples lives (probably a bunch of people who sucked to begin with but thats neither here nor there). i think the main point is that its not that he is reformed and thats the reason he shouldnt die...

the point is he became an actual advocate against the crimes he committed. in a big way. he wrote books and became a recognized public figure. i think its really fucking stupid to kill him considering keeping him alive could possibly do more good than killing him.

i mean why are there even jails? just to house people who do fucked up things? shouldnt reform be encouraged? this is just saying 'yeah you can commit crime and have no remorse and be released and commit more crimes or you can go to jail and be reformed and try to live your life the way we deem is right and contribute to society...either way we dont really give a shit.' which is probably why the US prison system is so terrible compared to other countries.

but i dont know. this guy dying isnt going to effect the way my breakfest tastes so fuck it.

this has nothing to do with nothing but it's arnold's reasoning behind not giving up clemency


Arnold’s official response is here, and here are some key aspects (.pdf):
http://www.governor.ca.gov/govsite/pdf/pre...2005/Williams_Clemency_Decision.pdf

he basis of Williams’ clemency request is not innocence. Rather, the basis of the request is the “personal redemption Stanley Williams has experienced and the positive impact of the message he sends.”4 But Williams’ claim of innocence remains a key factor to evaluating his claim of personal redemption. It is impossible to separate Williams’ claim of innocence from his claim of redemption.

Cumulatively, the evidence demonstrating Williams is guilty of these murders is strong and compelling. It includes: (1) eyewitness testimony of Alfred Coward, who was one of Williams’ accomplices in the 7-Eleven shooting; (2) ballistics evidence proving that the shotgun casing found at the scene of the motel murders was fired from Williams’ shotgun; (3) testimony from Samuel Coleman that Williams confessed that he had robbed and killed some people on Vermont Street (where the motel was located); (4) testimony from James and Esther Garrett that Williams admitted to them that he committed both sets of murders; and (5) testimony from jailhouse informant George Oglesby that Williams confessed to the motel murders and conspired with Oglesby to escape from county jail. The trial evidence is bolstered by information from Tony Sims, who has admitted to being
an accomplice in the 7-Eleven murder. Sims did not testify against Williams at trial, but he was later convicted of murder for his role in Albert Owens’ death. During his trial and subsequent parole hearings, Sims has repeatedly stated under oath that Williams was the shooter.

Based on the cumulative weight of the evidence, there is no reason to second guess the jury’s decision of guilt or raise significant doubts or serious reservations about Williams’ convictions and death sentence. He murdered Albert Owens and Yen-I Yang, Yee-Chen Lin and Tsai-Shai Lin in cold blood in two separate incidents that were just weeks apart.


***

Is Williams’ redemption complete and sincere, or is it just a hollow promise? Stanley Williams insists he is innocent, and that he will not and should not apologize or otherwise atone for the murders of the four victims in this case. Without an apology and atonement for these senseless and brutal killings there can be no redemption. In this case, the one thing that would be the clearest indication of complete remorse and full redemption is the one thing Williams will not do.

Clemency decisions are always difficult, and this one is no exception. After reviewing and weighing the showing Williams has made in support of his clemency request, there is nothing that compels me to nullify the jury’s decision of guilt and sentence and the many court decisions during the last 24 years upholding the jury’s decision with a grant of clemency.

Therefore, based on the totality of circumstances in this case, Williams’ request for clemency is denied.

Fuck him.....die.

dan nli said:

That's called reform. Therefore the point IS that he reformed and that is why he shouldn't die.

http://californiaexecution.ytmnd.com/#

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,178521,00.html
He is dead.

yes i heard it on NPR this morning too.

This fucker was on Death row for 24 years.He should have been executed back the 80s.All nigger gang members should be put to death.Their fucking useless.

InventorofEvil said:

dude death row records isn't even that old.

death penalty is stupid, it costs too much, takes too long and in the end it proves nothing. Let "tookie" serve the rest of his life in prison. However if the govenator says its ok im cool with it.

does he look like he would feel bad for anything?
he doesn't in have, what you call, feelings.

when death is staring you in the face, especially the moment of it, you will say ANYTHING to live. sure he did some great things against crime, but he has to pay for what he did. he stole 4 peoples lives. those people he murdered had no chance for redemption, or a chance to show him that they are good people and should be spared. how about all the lives that the "Crips" steal on a daily basis? all because of him? he got what he deserved.

Our society breeds crime through poverty and social gaps, then our solution is to kill these people. Wasn't the point of our "justice system" to reform people? Why have we murdered this man? What options did he have growing up that led him to believe forming a gang was a good idea? Another thing, we have DNA testing available now, if this guy maintained his innocence for 30 years, why the hell didn't they at least retest the evidence before executing him? Doesn't everyone deserve that? Even if he was guilty, regardless of that, he was trying to redem himself, where are you so called "forgiving" christians now?

I definatly wasn't talking about the wobblies and the leftist labor movement groups and organizers of the early 20th century when I called the protesters 'faggo-leftist ACLU types. I'm talking about the modern, hard line, mentally deranged leftists who'll fight for abortion rights till their death but will hold a candle light vigil out side a prison when they execute rapists, murderers, and child molesters. All I have to say about the ACLU is that they supported NAMBLA pro bono (that means FOR FREE!!). You might remember the case, it stemmed off the conviction of two fags who subsribed to NAMBLA that raped and murdered a 10 year old. Anyone who supports the ACLU is a disgrace to this country.

I said all that shit to 'FAGGO-LEFTIST-ACLU TYPE'

hungta‘bleed said:

You are dumb and don't read case history very well.

Actually, I'm pretty sure you are just talking out of your ass. Your arguements are about as sound as something overheard in an old-man bar at lunch time.

oh man, here comes Dr. Josh Martin...

yeah, i don't agree with the death penalty...if someone murders a member of my family, I would want to kill my family's murderer myself. So they will feel pain while i cut up various pieces of their body. That's justice!

ArrowHead nli said:


still agree with this.

succubus said:

how cool would it be if they would let the family of the victim physically inject or flick the switch for a death penalty? pretty cool I would imagine. hahaha.

RustedAngel said:

You are quite the Einstein yourself.

"Huh huh, the death penalty is cool beavis"

butthead looks more like you in that picture.

yeah.. there's some place that they do that..

china?

no...

europe?

naw, that's not it..

australia?

nope.

oh yeah, iran... way to want to be like the terrorists.


good thing you guys like the bible...

they do a lot of that in the bible.

wanting to do something and doing something is what separates us from the animals.
oh wait, we live in the US and do whatever the fuck we want.

yeeeee haw

nicely compiled

hahahahahahah

hungta‘bleed said:

If you don't like America, then leave.

USA for USA!

BornSoVile said:

Trust me on this one man, that kid loves America more than just about anybody as do I. I don't like the direction this country is going, neither does he. He also doesn't say anything in there that isn't true, every bit of that is fact. To deny that a vast majority of the Left in this country is pro-abortion (the killing of a human being depending on your views) but can turn around and be against capital punishment is just stupid. This is how these people think, it's contradiction after contradiction. The ACLU, thats an entriely different story but it is a fact, they support an organization whose objective is to promote pedophilia and teach its members the "proper" way to molest a child, and also how to get away with it. To me, that's a pretty fucked up, yet this same organization's President is now a Justice of the Supreme Court. But to say that someone deson't like America based on the fact that they told the truth is just wrong. I fuckin love this place as much as anyone and so doesn't my far Right-Wing associate Mr. To Bleed.

Why does everyone obcess about that case so much? Maybe if the kids parents actually watched him instead of letting him play in the streets he wouldn't have been kidnapped.
Shitting on the ACLU is dumb. Do you even know what it stands for? American Civil Liberties Union. Denouncing that = submitting to communism. This is America, land of the free. Rebpulicans are turning the stars and stripes into prison bars, they won't let you get that far. Thanks for supporting the downfall of liberty. Now move to Russia.

Wow guy, unfortunately you need to check your facts man. The ACLU is all about shitting all over you and making sure the scum of this country (drug addicts, pedophiles, illelgal immigrants) are protected, and Average Joe American has to deal with that. Any "civil liberties" union would never go to great lengths to help withhold the downfall of American culture that we are experiencing right now. This is America, we are free to do as we choose with the acceptance that our actions have consequences under the laws of the Consititution. You show me where it says that abortion is allowed under the constitution? You show me where it says it's OK to allow people who illegally enter this country the same rights as you and I as citizens? You show me where it's OK to allow some shit stain with to much time on his hands to argue that the words "under God" should not be used in the Pledge of Allegiance. Don't get me wrong I'm not religious in the least bit, but don't you think it's a sign of the times when people can win that fight, yet if they have a religious objection to abortion, they are chastized for having their particular view point. As far as the move to Russia remark, I don't know know how I could explain to you in words how much that infuriates me, I fuckin love this place with all my fucking heart guy, for you to say that is out of line.

VOTE ARNOLD DAT CAM.

http://www.arnoldexposed.com

All I have to say is fuck the ACLU they want to give full rights to the Man Boy fucking freaks whose motto is if they are 8 it's too late anyone who thinks that is cool being a pedophile of little boys I will fight fist to fist right now cause that is fucked. I will joke about many things cause I am DEATH METAL but when it comes to 40 yr old men fucking little boys I draw A very big broad line that I would love to see someone cross.

ArrowHead nli said:

uhh no thats not what i meant. anyone can claim to be reformed but not anyone can actually show that they are reformed in a constructive way. i dont think anyone who claims to be reformed should be granted clemency, that would be completely retarded.
but if you actually contribute something to society, than that would warrant clemency...

BMR said:

I worked for the fucking ACLU, don't lecture me on what they do. Stop listening to the conservative media. If your rant wasn't so jaded, I'd attempt to establish some facts but it's quite obvious that your lost. In your world without the ACLU you'd be shot for be a degenerate, it's not my fault you suck, so stop trying to proove otherwise.
Why do conservatives feel the need to whine about everything they fuck up????

As far as the whole attempt to assimilate abortion and the death penalty...are you fucking serious? the pratice of civil liberties ensures that the INDIVIDUAL is represented as an INDIVIDUAL. If you had you're way, we'd all be the same, conformist society blind to any fashionable morally ethical code. Communism man, communism.

Can anyone show me where it says in the Constitution that abortion is illegal?

If only all republicans were as dumb as the ones in this thread.

The ACLU defends the U.S. constitution. They defend the 1st ammendment rights of anyone from NAMBLA to the American Nazi Party.
(so much for your left wing conspiracy theories, but I guess you're too young to remember the Skokie case)

Right now, the ACLU is one of the few things keeping this country from turning into the USSR. Anyone against them either hates the constitution or is just plain stupid.

HOW DO YOU LIKE DEM APPLES

BMR said:

So you're equating a poverty stricken single mom choosing to end a pregnancy with the state sanctioned killing of a human being in a flawed justice system?
You're a real credit to your side.

Did BMR really just say the head of NAMBLA is a supreme court justice. Holy shit, I didn't think retardation was contagious.

Josh_Martin said:

Christ, Josh! Don't you know that the only women who get abortions are selfish sluts who don't want to deal with responsibility!? WOMEN ARE EVIL WE WENT OVER THIS BEFORE!!!! GOD!!!!!

YOU ARE ALL A BUNCH OF WHINEY BITCHES SHUT UP

hahhaha

BornSoVile said:
You're fucking so ignorant, and comepletely misinformed. The fucking fags that kidnapped him first stole his bike. They watched him wander around looking for it, then moved in for the kill and told the little kid "hey we know where your bike is"..the rest is history. If your gonna blame the parents for the actions of some selfish assfuckers, that just makes you an asshole. If you don't think that the ACLU is an organization that represents ONLY HARD LEFT CAUSES/GOALS/AIMS, then you my friend are viewing the world through the same Commie-Red rosie glasses that they are.
You're right though, this is America, land of the Free....
But do you honestly think we should be free enough to be able to publish material about how to abduct and rape kids. NAMBLA articles describe quote "rape and escape", how to rape a kid and get away from it. If you think that our freedoms should extent to such a right, then obviously you must have a stake in the legalization child porn you fucking sicko.

Ad Hominem is an awesome band, not so much an awesome tactic when you want to make a point.

Again, maybe if the parents watched the kid instead of letting him roam the fucking streets, this probably wouldn't have happened. I don't care if they robbed his bike and told him where it was, let me type it for you again, PARENTS SHOULDN'T LET 10 YEAR OLDS ROAM THE FUCKING CITY STREETS UNSUPERVISED.
CLARIFY THIS STATEMENT, IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE "If you don't think that the ACLU is an organization that represents ONLY HARD LEFT CAUSES/GOALS/AIMS, then you my friend are viewing the world through the same Commie-Red rosie glasses that they are." So, you're saying that conservatives are running the ACLU too, right?
Yes, I honestly think that if this is America where absolute freedom reigns, people should legalize child porn.

hungta‘bleed said:

Yes. I want to be that free. No one can tell me what I can or can't read. Welcome to America asshole.

My mom says there are alot of black people in Korea.

MorbidMike said:

You = gay. You wouldn't fight anyone. Shut up.
You are far from death metal. You seem pretty emo to me.

back to the original topic...i actually agree with this clown for once:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10284169/#051212a

TOOKIE WAS A FUCKUP
KILLING CHINESE PEOPLE "BECAUSE THEY ARE WHITE"
WHAT AN IDIOT
EUGENICS IN ACTION
GOD BLESS GOV SHWARZENEGRO

i hope all you pinko's have a loved one killed by one of these animals, maybe then you'll wise up

BMR said:



You're an idiot, and thats more than once you've made reference to abortion. According to your own arguments, we should be held accountable under the laws of the constitution. The constitution calls for seperation of law and religion. Furthermore, the constitution provides us freedom to chose and worship whatever faith we choose.

Would you, then, care to tell me where in the hell your christian views on abortion are supported by the constitution? Without faith or church, it's just a fucking fetus.

At this point, you should just go to hell.

Bradness nli said:



Actually, I'd much rather get rid of the animals altogether. Unfortunately, by setting such a standard of eye for an eye (which I already explained) we're just breeding MORE animals.

I hope you right wingers have a loved one get euthanized for a crime they didn't commit sometime. Maybe then you'll wise up as well.

dan nli said:

And your point was that through his writings, he had contributed to society.

Again! That IS reform! You're completely agreeing with what I've said, but you seem to refuse to label it correctly. Why?

So far, Mr. Martin is making the most sense! Though, the ACLU, be it as they may defend the constitution, but arent showing us "both sides". Racial Profiling illimination? Thats gay. Dismembering the patriot act? That is a step in the right direction, atleast for freedoms sake. Liberal Democrats and Stubborn Repulicans are trying to rape that sacred document, especially amendment number 1.

I will add my two cents: Haha Tookie. You're dead.... NOW... Lets hope your death starts a race riot.

BornSoVile said:
Enough said.
That’s pretty fucked up man....honestly.

Child porn impinges on the freedom of the innocent childred who are usually forced to participate. It's exploitive, and imposing on them.

We do NOT live in a country with ABSOLUTE freedom. That would be called anarchy. We live in a country where we are granted moderated freedom, where we are free to do as we will as long as it does not take away from the equal ability of others to do so as well.

BMR said:

Contradiction? like being pro-life and supporting the death penalty...or being pro-life and shooting a doctor?



The ACLU fights to keep the freedoms and protections that our government tries to errode away every day, from free speech to medical marijuana to environmental laws. I'm a card carrying member bitches.

First and foremost, I have absolutely no religious affiliation what so ever. I don't believe in God, if in the slim chance I grace his presence I'm going to have an awful lot of questions to ask about why things are the way they are. Secondly, if you believe you that child porongraphy is an acceptable form of media then you my friend are just plain fucking retarded. You call me a communist, yet I'm the one sticking up for the interests of the citizens of this country? I'm not a Conservative, I'm not a Liberal, I'm sure as shit not a Republican. I'm a plain old American who goes to work everyday to py the fucking bills. I'm pissed about the fact that everyday I have to see some fucking Brazilian who over stayed his green card make a better life then I simply because he's illegal, these mother fuckers are more protected by the government then I am, and I was fucking born here!!! Unfortunately we live in such a politicaly correct world that these scum fuckers cab't be caled out for what they are. As far as abortion. the debat will never end, if you can show me in the Constitition where it says that it is legal then I'll believe you, until then I see it as it is. The fact that the same people will support the abortion of "just a fetus" but condemn the death penalty is just contradiction. It's OK to kill something that will eventually become a human being (if it isn't already) but it's not OK to kill a living breathing person. Come on now, what the fuck is that? As far poor ole Tookie, he got what he fucking deserved, you kill 4 people, you should be given a lot more than a lethal injection, I'm an addvicate for the reinstation of torture and suffering in the method of execution. Perhaps I'm just fucking crazy, regardless my opinion is my opinion, not any other member of my band's although I know some of them feel the same way. You got an issue with it, bring it up with me, I'm not that bad of a person and I'm always down for an intelligent, researched argument. I'd rather not catch heat from a bunch of people on an internet message board about it.

ArrowHead nli said:

name. ONE NAME of a person that, without a doubt, was innocent. ONE NAME, with a link please.

abortion is a personal decision.
capital punishment is decided by a flawed system.
no logical person can compare the two...it's apples and oranges, and the paradox/hypocrite angle is a ridiculous basis for a very weak argument.

Bradness said:


http://majikthise.typepad.com/majikthise_/2005/11/texas_executed_.html



there ya go. it was in the herald, too. I heard about it on weei.

BMR said:

your post is too long winded and twisted, I have nothing worth while to contribute to the arguement cause you've lost me again. next time don't morph the topic into an assault on the ACLU, it's unamerican.
Conservative paranoia seems to be everywhere these days, maybe they know more than half of the country is on to them.

Where in the Constitution does it say that abortion is illegal?

Actually nobody needs to answer my question because I already know that there is nothing for or against abortion in the Constitution because the Constitution is not some divine unchanging object. It was meant to be interpreted and changed carefully throughout our nation's history. That's why every high school Civics class hammers away at the whole "The Constitution:It's A Living Document!" concept. And if you're blaming immigrants for your problems here's a solution, work harder, that's how the illegals get it done.

BobNOMAAMRooney nli said:

exactly.

LIFE IS SACRED!!!!

U.S. MILITARY DEATHS IN IRAQ: 2150
U.S. MILITARY WOUNDED IN IRAQ: 15881
IRAQI CIVILIAN DEATHS (MINIMUM): 27383


we're a thousand days in...

I heard the ACLU fabricated those numbers and weaved it into the liberal media so they could manipulate the people into thinking that NAMBLA is the biggest threat to our civilization since the civil rights movement.

ArrowHead nli said:

jesus fucking christ. READING COMPREHENSION. i didnt say its not reform you fucking jackass. i said the reason for clemency should not be the act of reform in itself, because if that was the case then any asshole who finds jesus should be granted.

but not every asshole who "finds jesus" or whatever goes on and actually contributes something to society because
a. they are not truly reformed
b. they lack the ability
c. they are in jail and its pretty fucking hard to reach the outside world in such a way when you are interred.

and when you actually can do this. you not only have shown that you are reformed but you actually show compelling evidence as to WHY you DESERVE clemency.

what i was trying to say wasnt that difficult to understand, retard.

IT'S TOO LATE!!! HE'S DEAD!!!!!!

and now we have to figure out who to blame..the man? the system? society?

blame game...commence.

CARRY ON!!!!

RUBEN CANTU WAS NO SAINT
OH WELL, DEATH COMES
7 BILLION PEOPLE
NOW LESS ONE
MORE TREES
PRAISE GOD

Who made the ACLU the 4th branch of government? Since when were they given such a prestigious standing in American politics? Last I checked they were nothing more than an INTEREST GROUP, therefor, they are about as credible as the NAACP, PFAW, Christian Coalition, etc...
To say that attacking the ACLU is unAmerican is like saying attacking the Christian Coalition is unAmerican. You just keep drinking the kool aid and continue to believe that the UNAmerican Civil Liberties Union represents the backbone of American values.

did someone say fried chicken?

I've read just about every post here and this is the trend that I noticed:

Bornsovile has used absolutely NO FACTS at all to back up one thing that he posted. Instead, he chose the easy way out of the argument and decided to spew condescending remarks to all of the "Conservatives" that posted here, who are actually using facts to back up what they are writing and who are making sense. I absolutely agree with hungtableed, who seems to really know an awful lot about what he is writing about. To say that not supporting the ACLU is unAmerican is simpy preposterous. They are simply an INTEREST GROUP.

If you want to know what the ACLU really supports, here are just a few FACTUAL examples (it's apparent that the ACLU is a left-wing interest group):

Removing nativity scenes from public property
Banning songs such as Silent Night from schools
Refusing to allow students to write about the Christian aspect of Christmas in school projects
Renaming Christmas break Winter break
Refusing to allow a city sponsored Christmas parade to be called a Christmas parade
Not allowing a Christmas tree in a public school
Renaming a Christmas tree displayed on public property a Holiday tree

In addition to their war on Christmas, the ACLU is all about:

Suing states to force them to legalize homosexual marriage
Forcing libraries to remove porn filters from their computers
Suing the Boy Scouts to force them to accept homosexuals as scout leaders
Helping to legalize child pornography (this is fucked up, and if you support this cause then I hope you have a son someday that gets relentlessly sodomized and gutted, then tell me how much you support this cause you sick fuck)
Legalizing live sex acts in bars in Oregon
Protecting the North American Man Boy Love Association, whose motto is "sex by eight or it is too late"
Censoring student led prayer at graduation
Removing "under God" from the Pledge of Allegiance
Removing "In God We Trust" on our currency

That picture of the iranian woman being buried alive is so fucking funny.

Who cares if they executed the guy, his killing days were over so he no longer served a purpose to me.

One more thing that I noticed, almost everyone here seems to assume that just because someone is a Conservative or is simply against abortion that automatically means that they are a Christian. What a ludicrous way of thinking. That is like me saying that every Liberal is a homosexual.

Every liberal is a homosexual.

Christina, I know you are ashamed of all the black cock you consumed in college, but what happens in the dorms stays in the dorms...your parents won't find out so you can relax.

ooof

Joe/NotCommon said:



It was predictable that you weren't going to have a valid rebuttal, but rather resort to an absurd and un-related remark.

I know that this is also un-related, but I’m just so curious, Joe, whatever happened to Not Common records?

The previous post was not meant to be anonymous, I typed it.

Christina said:

Separation of church and state...it's about bloody time someone fought for it. I think chirstians dominate enough in this country, now they bitch about christmas?



Wow, maybe if the circumstances surrounding the ACLU's protection of NAMBLA were revealed here it would completely change what you're trying to say...

http://www.nationalreview.com/murdock/murdock200402270920.asp

You forgot a few other things the ACLU fights against, like:
The Patriot Act
that “Intelligent Design” crap they want to teach in our public schools
a federal abortion ban
torture
FBI spying on religious and political groups

wow, I just noticed how many of those things were South Park episodes...

Sure, I think NAMBLA are a bunch of disgusting pervs, right up there with the Catholic priests who molest little boys, only they don't try to hide it. tHowever, to blame them for a murder commited by 2 sickos is retarded.

I keep thinking this is about ted williams

Freedom of Speech is not absolute, and you should know that. For instance, you cannot yell 'Fire!' in a crowded theatre. Publishing material that advocates and encourages that having sex with kids is O.K. is dangerous, and in every sense should be banned. So to say that the ACLU pigs stood up for NAMBLA because of freedom of speech, you are just are retarded as they.

tookie is dead.

anonymous said:

Absurd and unrelated is my creed, also I didn't read any posts in this thread.

hungta‘bleed said:

You're absolutely right. The ACLU supports child rape. You're totally on to them. I don't know what they were thinking, trying to pull a fast one like passing off the legalization of kid fuckery as defending the 1st ammendment, when there's a genius like you out there to stop them.
In fact, I'm getting blown by a 6 year old as I type this.

Christina said:

Wishing for someone's unborn child to be raped and gutted isn't exactly the best way of showing that you're for protecting children now is it?

Seriously the next time you decide you want to make a point on an internet message board why don't you try not to involve the totally unrelated and bizzare fixation on the physical and sexual abuse of children.

This started out as a discussion on Tookie Williams, A GROWN MAN with nothing to do with NAMBLA, until hungtableed tried to poison the well and accuse the ACLU of supporting child pornography.

Back on track, I believe that the death penalty is wrong because I do not think a state which derives its power from the people has the right to kill those same people.

hungta‘bleed said:

Missing the point entirely...the case was about a child being murdered, not freedom of speech. Despite NAMBLA being sick fuck-tards, their website didn't make 2 people murder a little boy.

You all make my ass itch.

I actually like where Joe is taking the topic...

I take pride in the mess I made here. On a message board filled with opinionated assholes (I'd be the first to admit that I fall in that category as well) all it takes is one 'controversial' statement to get the fucking ball rolling. Look at all the fun we've been having..........

Christina said:
I'd tell you to put this in the Conservative Fact Corner thread but since it does a great disservice to your argument, you better not, you already look pretty stupid.

What are you the fucking O'Reilly factor? What another lame attempt to slander and smear me, I love all the reverse psychology "bsv is mean and ignorant and condesending", cry a fucking river build a bridge and get over it and tell your hungtobleed buddy to toughen up and quit the whining. The best part is that you've prooved my point about how the ACLU fights to preserve freedoms along with abolishing restrictions and injustices that are as old and out dated as the year 1775. Thanks for listing all those facts and then spinning it off like as if it's another liberal conspracy designed to overthrow christian values or whatever, we should all feel so threatened by the wrath of the ACLU, them and their pro-constitutional representation of liberty is a massive threat to this system. Don't you realize you're essentially protesting the logical reasoning of the foundation of this country? Smooth, real smooth, I hope that isn't too ignorant and condesending for you.
Yeah it's a fucking interest group, cause more than half of the fucking country is INTERESTED in being represented within the government, and guess what it's only getting worse! In the future christians and whites will be the minority, do you really expect a nation to adhere to an outdated code of whatever that is as foreign to them as the idea of us submitting to instant totalitarian mexican rule? try that on for a fucking scenario. TOUGH SHIT, THIS IS AMERICA, THAT IS ALLOWED, IF YOU DON'T LIKE FUCKING LEAVE.
The beauty of liberalism is that it promotes the will to power, to seize the day, to be all you can be. That's what makes it different than conservatism. Go ahead spin the olde "how can you say that, it's so ignorant" fucking look it up in the fucking dictionary, or am I gona have to do all the work for you????

hungta‘bleed said:

Do you take pride in stimulating a bombardment of enlightenment or do you do it cause you want to say immature things just to piss people off?

hungta‘bleed said:

Don't act like you planned on making this mess to get out of the whole arguement. It's clear from your statements earlier in this thread that you were talking out of your ass and just being a reactionary retard.

You've failed to make any points and you haven't "stuck it to those liberal gaywads! OHOHOHOHO!" by pulling the whole "I just said it to stir things up" act.

BobNOMAAMRooney nli said
Don't act like you planned on making this mess to get out of the whole arguement. It's clear from your statements earlier in this thread that you were talking out of your ass and just being a reactionary retard.

You've failed to make any points and you haven't "stuck it to those liberal gaywads! OHOHOHOHO!" by pulling the whole "I just said it to stir things up" act.>>

What the fuck are you talking about? When did I say anything about 'trying to get out of the whole argument'? I'll defend my political position all day, just like everyone of you who care enough to inform themselves of the issues we face. I made the first statement about this and I included facts about why I detest the ACLU, it's idiots like you who were the 'reactionary retards' who responded by telling me that I should move to Russia, rather than an educated rebuttal. Show me where I can learn of all the knowledgeable points you made on this issue...

that was such a weak cop out, fucking convservatives to scared/retarded to finish the bullshit they start. The best is that everyone except his girlfriend pratically said he was wrong, and he still thinks he's right. and I'M THE IGNORANT ONE????
PUT ANOTHER POINT ON THE BOARD!

First of all, I didn't cop out on shit, so fuck you. I'll argue my point of view anyday. If you want to keep insisting that I offered no facts to my arguement, back up a little and read what I had written. Where are all your facts, buddy? Aside from warm shit, you havn't offered one splinter of fact to back up your claim other than by stating the typical kool-aid drinkers responce that the 'ACLU protects our rights'

Secondly, in this matter...no one will be considered right or wrong, these are our opinions. The same of which are argued everyday in every form of media we have access to. It is a never ending cycle. You think you're right, and I'll always think I'm right. Anything you say, or anyone says on a non-political message will never convince me that my views are wrong. Just as I would expect that would not change thier beliefs on my opinions that I express.

hungta‘bleed said:

hey einstein, read my fucking post to your girlfriend, she posted all the facts about the ACLU, unfortunately for you they prooved everyone here right. what else do you want facts on? work on your conviction better.

hungta‘bleed said:

dualism is a bitch. next time don't start a fire you can't put out.

The point that is attempted to be conveyed in stating that the ACLU attacks religion is that we as citizens are protected with a 'freedom of religion', not a 'freedom from religion'. The fact that the ACLU has crosses torn off of war memorials under the guise of seperation of church and state is a crock of shitty cum. Another great action by the ACLU was when their NY branch sued the state to have a billboard depicting Osama bin Laden with a target on his head to be removed. It was quote "offensive to muslims". The ACLU are at the spearhead of the p.c. movement that is destroying the U.S. Political correctness is fucking gay and is getting out of control.

BobNOMAAMRooney nli said:

You're obviously missing my point, either that or you know what I meant, but just want to argue with me. What I meant by typing that is you (or whomever supports child pornography) may be all for child pornography right now because it doesn't directly effect your life, but if you have a child someday who gets raped by some sick fuck, are you still going to support child pornography? The answer is obvious. Therefore, if your child getting raped is what it will take for you to be able to comprehend how horrendous child pornography is, then I hope it happens to your kid.

BobNOMAAMRooney nli said:

Well, seriously, the next time you decide you want to make a point on an internet message board why don't you try reading all of the posts to find out who initially introduced the topic before accusing me of bringing this into discussion. You sound like a dolt.

BobNOMAAMRooney nli said:

OK, it’s now obvious to me that you’re an ignoramus and you didn’t even read my initial post. “Accuse the ACLU of supporting child pornography.” Why don’t you do some research on the ACLU and the causes that they support, because I’ve certainly done plenty of research on my own, especially during my first few years of college for Composition and Political Science courses. It is a fact not an accusation that the ACLU wants to legalize child pornography.

You lean to the Left, I lean to the Right. The only reason why I cannot extiguish this upheaval is simply because my point of view is obviosly out numbered here. You'd be a weak minded fool if you would allow someone's point of view that was expressed over a message board to change your beliefs.

dan NLI said:

Again, you don't get it.

Reform does not mean finding jesus. That's "reborn".

Reform is exactly the argument you've been making. Go look the word up. You said in the first post I quoted that it's not about reform. Then proceded to say that instead of reform people should have to prove they are no longer a threat, and make valid attempts to contribute to society. That's reform dude, you're arguing with yourself over a word you don't understand. Who's the retard?

So the death penalty, arguements for and against it. I want to hear things that go beyond "I THINK THOSE ANIMALS SHOULD ALL BE KILLED!!!!!!!!! IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT I WILL FUCKING PUNCH YOU IN THE FACE AND I HOPE SOMEONE IN YOUR FAMILY GETS KILLED SO YOU CAN SEE HOW IT FEELS!"

Here's an issue I have with the death penalty, one of the statements that gets thrown around after an execution is "Finally the victim's family has closure" Do statements such as that imply that our justice system does not work unless someone ends up dead for their crime? Why is the state allowed to murder the felon when we do not allow family members of the victim to kill the murderer out of vengeance? You could argue that family members would kill without looking at all the facts and murder whoever they thought was the most likely suspect because humans are flawed. But aren't many of the politicians who support the death penalty motivated by their own passions and base desire for power with the importance they place on being tough on crime to win votes?

my head hurts to much to read this.
I just think of all the people out there who are executed and then found innocent a year later.

BobNOMAAMRooney nli said:
But aren't many of the politicians who support the death penalty motivated by their own passions and base desire for power with the importance they place on being tough on crime to win votes?
>>
I agree with you here.

Christina said:

Nope I'm not missing your point, you outright said that if someone supports the ACLU they fully support child pornography and then you wished rape and murder on the child of ACLU supporters. In reality you can support some of the work an organization does while being completely disgusted by their other work. It's part of the compromise of having free speech. Everyone has the right to use their voice no matter how vile they are and if you happen to disagree with them its your right to shout them down.

Frankly I'm amazed that people are getting so worked up about rape and murder on this board considering the lyrics of EVERY GOREGRIND BAND EVER.

BSV said:


I typed not one slanderous or smearing remark about you, nor did I call you mean or ignorant, so chill the fuck out and re-read what I typed before you cry and make shit up. Unless you actually know what you’re talking about, shut the fuck up. I made not one complaint about America or not liking America so honestly, you sound like a fucking dunce by inferring that I meant anything like that. I absolutely love this country and will never live anywhere else, and just because I don’t agree with a left-wing interest group doesn’t make me unAmerican or mean that I need to leave the country. That is illogical thinking. There seemed to be confusion as to what causes the ACLU supports and so I submitted factual causes that they do support. All I typed about you is that you haven’t used one fact to back up anything that you typed, and rather than having a coherent retort, you decided to name call and avoid the facts. No one is whining about anything, except for you in this response to my first post. We are all simply overly-opinionated people who just so happen to have very different opinions.

Your elite attitude fucking sucks.

Child molestation rules.

just wanted to add that the only comment i made in here was a joke...this thread turned quite serious

Christina said:

Could you post a link or something to support that statement please?

Better yet, can you post a link of naked 15 year old girls?

Joe/NotCommon said:


I can.

www.myspace.com

Josh_Martin said:



Read up on this case that the ACLU lost:


New York v. Ferber, 458 U.S. 747.


“The ACLU's position is this: criminalize the production but legalize the sale and distribution of child pornography. This is the kind of lawyerly distinction that no one on the Supreme Court found convincing. And with good reason: as long as a free market in child pornography exists, there will always be some producers willing to risk prosecution. Beyond this, there is also the matter of how the sale of child pornography relates either to free speech or the ends of good government. But most important, the central issue is whether a free society should legalize transactions that involve the wholesale sexploitation of children for profit.
The ACLU objects to the idea that porn movie producers be required to maintain records of ages of its performers; this would be “a gross violation of privacy."

let's talk about things that are way better than this debate



actually, everything is better than this thread.

Christina said:

Hey, I'm not that one that's the jesus freak. I'm the the typical liberal who stands up for the little guy. You get pissed at me for calling you unamerican because you want to restrict an individuals freedom, well tough shit then. You can call me all the names you want, it won't change the fact that you believe in repressing the citizens of the nation under a mandate of god (among other things) and that pisses me off. Me calling you unAmerican and Communist is a compliment towards your blasphemy within your arguement.
more later I gotta go to pratice....

Hey guys look, Abe Lincoln.

Christina said:

Please post the link correctly.
It doesn't work and more than one paragraph is needed to understand the case.

I love how "non-liberals" (is that good enough?) think that there is nothing more to being American than being white and showing up to a full time job...

http://www.aclu.org/freespeech/protest/11289prs20000831.html

aclu press release on why we defended Nambla

Josh_Martin said:

yes, please. I would love to see the source.

also, since we're throwing the word "elitist" around...
sitting in a classroom and reading assigned publications could mean that you are well informed.
It could also mean that you are easily lead.

ArrowHead nli said:

uhhh no you fuckwit. you are trying to drag me into an argument over semantics. do you know anything about what actually warrants clemency? im done replying because its the lowest common denominator that starts arguments over semantics and tells people who have repeatedly explained themself that they dont know what they are talking about. you are really smart on the internet, eh?

Josh Martin:
All you have to do is Google 'New York v. Ferber, 458 U.S. 747'
You'll get a multitude of sites that explain the case.

dan nli said:

You're really annoying the hell out of me. YOU started an argument about semantics when you rebutted my original post. NOW you've lost, and have nothing to resort to but insults. What the fuck is wrong with you, that you can't even admit you're wrong?

I made a post saying we had a reform based prison system. You jumped in saying that it's not about reform, but rather it's about the prisoner showing change. In other words, reform. You've been arguing the same damned thing this whole time since. You weren't talking about clemency, which I understand just fine, you said "It's not about reform". For christs sake, how hard is it for you to admit "okay, maybe it IS about reform"?

Seriously, agrue all you'd like on the interweb. It'll just lead to a bit of frustration and making yourself look like an ass. However, theres no need to keep resorting to insults. Learn to disagree like an adult, dan.

Nothing changes the fact that hungtobleed fucked himself when he turned the topic into a rant against the ACLU and tried justifying his cause by bringing up a case from years ago, which I'm assuming has already closed and is completly meaningless to the issue at hand. I havn't even argued for against the death penalty! The simple fact is the he is very mislead. He spewed his rhetoric upon us and got owned by everyone here. AND WE'RE THE IGNORANT ONES???? RIOOOGGHHHTTTTT...

I didn't get owned by shit. I'd bet a million bucks that the ratio of flaming libs to conservatives here is probably 10:1. You blew it out of proportion when you got all offended cause I referred to the protesters as faggo-leftist-ACLU-types. If anyone is mislead it is the kool aid drinkers that think the ACLU is the crux of American values and the backbone of American politics. They are a radical left wing pressure group. There are almost 300 million citizens in the U.S., the ACLU membership is just over 400,000. Only a booger of a percentage of U.S. citizens agree with them enough that they became honorary card carrying members....

Just because he says to drink the kool aid, doesn't mean its good for you

hungta‘bleed said:

not nearly as offended as you there chief. at least we all thought for ourselves and didn't have our girl friends do the dirty work. Choose your battles wiser next time and stop blaming all your problems on liberals, that's just weak.

hungta‘bleed said:

Next time don't lead everyone onto the hysteria that they're controlling the country, better yet don't let them ruin your day. If it bothers you so much, start organizing and do something about it other than making half assed arguements on the net. Though this one has been fun nonetheless.

First off, my old lady does what ever the fuck she wants. If you think that she is here giving me one liners, or vice versa, you're dead wrong.
Secondly, my argument was no more half assed than your defense.
Lastly, Notwithstanding the fact that we disagree on the issue. I'll agree with you that this has been rather entertaining.

good, now we can smoke weed in peace.

END OF THREAD.

what the fuck does drink the kool aid mean in this context?

Drink the wine, Drink the wine! they'll be here with flame throwers! Drink Drink! in a few seconds you'll feel drowsy, you'll lie down and go to sleep, sleep forever.

Jim Jones hoaxed his christian group to drink poison that was in koolaid. Oh yeah, hahahah Tookie, you are dead. Fuck you Elephants, and Fuck you Donkeys. You are all going in circles. Love the Gemini

i still don't get the People's Temple references.
It's not very witty, considering it's the gun toting, pro wrestling watching, red state, stars and stripes forever, religiously fanatic, right wing, bovine american who just does what they're told. Drink Bud and go to sleep America, you're government is in control...

Dead Nigger Storage.

Fiend for Blood!!!!! Not just "Gun toting Republicans" are dillusional. Everyone is, including you Civil Rights homo. I cant believe people still care for this government. The constiution is being repremanded, who cares about people that only push with half their might (dems and repubs) Hail extremists only!

Hail spelling and punctuation.

p.s. I think the fries are done.

i want french fries right now! you get the point though mr. Domestic Terror! Beer mixed with typing probably is penalty for puncuation AND spelling, im splleignadsgs . oh well! Both sides will keep whining, and when your on the funeral bed at 60, you will maybe see that life was wasted and useless. Feel the scythe of the soul reaper!

My spelling of "your" (which should be you're) might cause a passionate burst from your clicking typing hand...

BornSoVile said:



I encourage you to correct me if I’m wrong, but aren’t you the one who posted these words?

“Shitting on the ACLU is dumb. Do you even know what it stands for? American Civil Liberties Union. Denouncing that = submitting to communism. This is America, land of the free. Rebpulicans are turning the stars and stripes into prison bars, they won't let you get that far. Thanks for supporting the downfall of liberty. Now move to Russia.”

“If you had you're way, we'd all be the same, conformist society blind to any fashionable morally ethical code. Communism man, communism.”

“next time don't morph the topic into an assault on the ACLU, it's unamerican.”


It’s apparent that you are extremely confused. You certainly have no clue what you are talking about because Communism is to the far LEFT on the political spectrum. How would disagreeing with a Liberal (left-wing, but to the right of Communism) interest group make me more left-wing? You clearly don’t even know what a Communist is...nice try though.

You are the one who seems to think that the ACLU is so important and is leading the country. You even wrote it yourself that assaulting the ACLU is unAmerican and is submitting to Communism. Your thinking is completely irrational. The next time that you want to proclaim that you’ve won an argument, you should try making a bit more sense and actually use facts to back up what you type.

There really is no “winning” when it comes to heated political discussions like this one, so to declare that someone just got owned when you haven’t even used one fact, but merely your own misled (don’t argue this one, you truly are misled if you think that denouncing the ACLU is submitting to Communism) opinion to retort, is inane.

That previous post was typed by me.

Josh_Martin said:




Hopefully this works:

http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/historics/USSC_CR_0458_0747_ZS.html

DJ death said:

I'm very much with you.

Hahahaha Christina owned you All P.S. FUCK The Aclu and fuck pedophiles and if anyone wants to disagree and say they love kiddy porn cause its america and free well then let me know so I can come rape your ass cause you know its america home of the free now fuck off!Your Pal Morbid Mike

1/2 nambla's main council post here.
joenc, I'm looking your way...

Christina said:

Yes, that worked.

After reading that you really think the ACLUs goal was to legalize kiddie porn? That's a real shortcut to thinking.
Their arguement was that the law that banned it was too broad. Slippery slope y'know? They were fighting a poorly written law, not trying to legalize kiddie porn.

Their arguement was strong enough for the New York appellate court to agree with them.

MorbidMike said:

You are the smartest person here. Seriously.

Hey whoa now! We the ACLU Have made America safe for Pedophiles, Gansters, Baby Rapers,Abortionists, Homosexuals, and Parents who firmly inforce punishment on thier kids( i.e. aaa spanking or a punch to the face) cause god damn thins is America built on principles we obviously don't follow so blindly follow us the ACLU or it will be your demise Progressive and Ourselves will make sure of it.-Chairmen of The ACLU Mr. I Lick Balls!

Ok, so I've ignored this thread until today. Did I miss anything?

all this talk about french fries and licking balls....
I think I just got a boner
damnit.... I gotta take a shit

BobNOMAAMRooney nli said:

Chaos comes soon! Aware, Beware, War.

hahahaha

that guy fuckin' rules!
great white looks like it was written in cum spew

RustedAngel said:

Still not as rad as the wikked sic Twiztio ink

MorbidMike said:

Graduate High School first.
She posted a bunch of facts that supported OUR arguement. Let me repeat that, she posted a bunch of facts that supported OUR arguement. Did you understand that, cause you didn't understand that she posted a bunch of facts that supported OUR arguement, you can't fathom simple English in writing. In your supreme vision without the ACLU, you'd probably be shot for ignoring the basic fundamental concepts of the English language along with being a total idiot. Why do you pussies have such a problem with criminals?? What the hell are you singing about? Flowers and rainbows?? Pull your heads out of your asses or quit music.

BobNOMAAMRooney nli said:

BornSoVile said:


Woah buddy, the music of any band that posts here has absolutely nothing to do with this political topic, and yet you chastised hungtobleed about introducing a new topic into this thread...

Like I posted previously, you're the one with the elite fucking attitude - pull your head out of your ass you fucking hypocrite.

Your just jealous I'm more extreme, hardlined and more witty than you'll ever be.
The music certainly does have something to do with this, cause this is a metal board not a fucking political forum, you just havn't realized that yet.
If you're so outraged about the Dechristianization of Christmas, tell you're boyfriends band not to play with Vital Remains, they hate christ more than liberals.
And here's another one for you to ponder over and twist, the ACLU would be one of the first organizations to support Extreme Metal if it was ever to be banned or whatever. Horrible people, simply horrible. Damn the bill of rights and fuck the constitution, they always seem to proove you wrong. Can't fuck with that!

I'm going to go listen to Susvourtre because I loooooove me some underaged snatch. You know, believing in free speech and all.